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Emmanuel Giannoulakis (emmanuel)
Advisor
From: Greece
Posts: 942
Dears.
I will here try to expose my traditional honing as has been broadcasted to me
from my father on always coticule hones.Bofore ,i would like to justify my self why i prefer coticules.1} Is naturals (not chemical in the binder) 2) Non porus stones (never keeps steel or dirty) 3} existing in different shapes,sizes,cosmetics colors and also in different honing sense for any taste.4) Are usualy in pale colors allowing to monitor the slurry darkness and finaly is a thing that exists to the earth subsoil million years ago as beautifull amber .
At issue. I start with a non thick slurry controllng and adding water to be a slihgt homogeneous milky slurry. Dont forget that during honing on the slurry ,the stone releases additional slurry so not allowed to be thicker than the starting thickness. I hold the razor from the shank with my prevalent hand letting the stone loose in the left palm. I place the blade on the hone performing circular ,I would say elliptical moves clockwise through the hone length pushing the slurry from the left side to right side keeping always the edge front, moving the blades in same time from heel to the point (estimate 20 elliptical moves).Then I proceed with two X strokes to the same blades side like the bow on the violin strings. Twisting the blade in the same way but this time unclockwise diluting and keeping the slurry always same or a little bit thinner than the previus stage .Always I finish the every side honing with two X strokes. Honing the point must be do it,arriving until the hone centerline. For the heel as close as possible Once I feel the edge is sharp I continue with 50 ,60 X strokes on water. If everything is well ,according Barts scale clearly I have a HHT #3-4.
I don’t place my finger on the blade ,but I tried and I had the same result .Thats my little method .I would like the experienced to try it and especially Bart. With the Bart dilucot method I succeed the same good result the unique different is that with the mine I am faster and I believe that happens because of many years I repeat it.
Best regards
Emmanuel
Emmanuel Giannoulakis
from Athens Greece
2011-01-03 21:26
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Dr Ralfson Bwhahaha (tat2Ralfy)
Associate
Posts: 3610
That is wonderful, thank you for sharing Emmanuel :)

The only thing I think I do not understand is how many times you dilute the slurry?

I simply can not wait to try this method, I am not used to doing circles at all, but feel sure that I can achieve some degree of success

Many thanks again and best wishes
Ralfson (Dr)
We Are All Pioneers In Our Own Right.
The Infamous Coticule Crew
Pip Pip Old Bean
2011-01-03 23:40
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Emmanuel Giannoulakis (emmanuel)
Advisor
From: Greece
Posts: 942
icontat2Ralfy:
The only thing I think I do not understand is how many times you dilute the slurry?

Hellow Ralf
Surely 15 times ,as i said is more heliptical(oval) than circular motions.
Go ahead .I am sure you ll have a perfect result.
Emmanuel
Emmanuel Giannoulakis
from Athens Greece
2011-01-04 00:03
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Dr Ralfson Bwhahaha (tat2Ralfy)
Associate
Posts: 3610
Thank you my friend I shall try tomorrow evening

This sounds almost exactly as Bart's Dilucot only using Elliptical stroke and not the back and forth half strokes

Wonderful indeed, I believe we are blessed that you share this old method.

Best wishes
Ralfson (Dr)
We Are All Pioneers In Our Own Right.
The Infamous Coticule Crew
Pip Pip Old Bean
2011-01-04 00:07
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Emmanuel Giannoulakis (emmanuel)
Advisor
From: Greece
Posts: 942
icontat2Ralfy:
Thank you my friend I shall try tomorrow evening

This sounds almost exactly as Bart's Dilucot only using Elliptical stroke and not the back and forth half strokes

Wonderful indeed, I believe we are blessed that you share this old method.

Best wishes
Ralfson (Dr)

Ralf
To make more clear the motion ,the larger diameter of oval motion should be parallel to the blade.After 20 oval laps two X strokes same side.
Regard
Emmanuel
Emmanuel Giannoulakis
from Athens Greece
2011-01-04 00:20
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vgeorge
+1
Posts: 273
Emmanuel, thanks very much for posting your technique that you inherited. :thumbup: Please don't be concerned if you don't have this - do you have access to a video camera, or even a webcam to record your technique and post it?
Thanks again.
George
------
Proud owner of Franz Kline Coticule from Ardennes via Bart
Hoping for Edge, Working on Bevel. © 2010
2011-01-04 00:45
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Bart Torfs (Bart)
Associate
From: Belgium
Posts: 5001
Hi Emmanuel,

I love it! So you were already diluting years before I ever started boring the internet with it? :) Great! Another wheel I reinvented.:D

I completely agree with what you said about why you prefer Coticules as well. Once you grow accustomed to a Coticile it's hard to like someting else, maybe with the exception of some of the pale Japanese natural whetstones.

As far as the helicoptical strokes are concerned (I love that term), here's an old video of mine that shows me doing something similar? I start off with halfstrokes, but after flipping the razor I switched over to what I believe to be "helicoptical" halfstrokes. Of course, the real secret is that I bend the last digit of my index finger backwards while honing. That makes all the difference. :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xjr5Kd6mTWI

Thanks for the explanation, I too would love to see you do it on video.

Kind regards,
Bart.
Then the light shone, trumpets sounded and I got to the other side, where men shave with smiles on their faces, razors pop hairs, and a continuous choir singing «~~Keen and Smooth~~» is heard everywhere. (Matt)
2011-01-04 00:54
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Chris Calvé (wdwrx)
From: Canada
Posts: 703
That's pretty cool. I too almost always do a couple x-strokes between sets of half stokes, but I do it to mix the new drop of water into the slurry more evenly, and it helps me to see how the water rides up the bevel.
I'd be interested in seeing a video too.:thumbup:
2011-01-04 01:52
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jfdupuis
Posts: 507
+1 on the video. I do circles too. Usually only in the bevel setting stage though.
The Friendly Canuck
GO HABS GO!
2011-01-04 02:05
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cyclelu
From: United States
Posts: 72
Great post, thank you for sharing. I liked the video also.

I am more comfortable doing circles in both directions than the half strokes.

Best regards,
Lu
2011-01-04 03:26
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pinklather
Posts: 176
Emmanuel, Thank You!!

I'm in the process of correcting a poor X-stroke on the return stroke for a smiling blade. I seem to have trouble keeping the edge flat as I conclude that return stroke. It would be no surprise to find the toe of my edges have been sub-standard. I found that a few elliptical strokes would return the toe to a fine level. I'm now doing my strokes with the dominant elbow (arm holding the razor) held parallel to the floor, and a smooth, flat stroke is easier. Like yourself, I find the elliptical strokes much faster than the alternatives.

That you learned this way from your father is great. If he is still alive, please let him know he is helping many of us through you.
2011-01-04 04:50
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Emmanuel Giannoulakis (emmanuel)
Advisor
From: Greece
Posts: 942
Friends thank you very much for your comments My brain is not comletely compatible with video-cameras,you tube etc to damostrate a video.I am sure that Bart is able to perform my method with comlete success however he did it at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xjr5Kd6mTWI
For the mate pinklather i live five yesrs without my father but i learned from him all the beatifull little things giving the true beauty in life.
At your disposal
Emmanuel
Emmanuel Giannoulakis
from Athens Greece
2011-01-05 00:46
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Emmanuel Giannoulakis (emmanuel)
Advisor
From: Greece
Posts: 942
icontat2Ralfy:
That is wonderful, thank you for sharing Emmanuel :)

The only thing I think I do not understand is how many times you dilute the slurry?

I simply can not wait to try this method, I am not used to doing circles at all, but feel sure that I can achieve some degree of success

Many thanks again and best wishes
Ralfson (Dr)

Well friend Ralf.
Did you try the method.
I need your impressions.
Emmanuel
Emmanuel Giannoulakis
from Athens Greece
2011-01-05 00:55
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Dr Ralfson Bwhahaha (tat2Ralfy)
Associate
Posts: 3610
I am sorry to hear of your loss my friend

I have not yet had the time to try your method, also do you add water each time you have worked both sides of blade, so at start of each second set of elliptical strokes yes?

Best regards
And many thanks
Ralfson (Dr)
We Are All Pioneers In Our Own Right.
The Infamous Coticule Crew
Pip Pip Old Bean
2011-01-05 01:05
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Emmanuel Giannoulakis (emmanuel)
Advisor
From: Greece
Posts: 942
icontat2Ralfy:
I am sorry to hear of your loss my friend

I have not yet had the time to try your method, also do you add water each time you have worked both sides of blade, so at start of each second set of elliptical strokes yes?

Best regards
And many thanks
Ralfson (Dr)

Yes i add water once for both sides but depends on the density i never leave slurry to be thker
than the previus stage thats my secret.
Ill continue multiingualism post.
Emmanuel
Emmanuel Giannoulakis
from Athens Greece
2011-01-05 01:32